Feedback wanted for judges.

[Mariah Carey]

I just want the two of you to work things out.

[Lana Del Ray]

Both of you really need to work it out. Talk to each other. This game supposed to be fun but this isn't fun anymore.. Sort it out.

Next cycle, I'll have official guidelines on what the models can submit or can't for their photo. I thought everyone already cleared with screencaps or photoshop or words on your photo.

[Lana Del Ray]

Janice, please talk to Amanda. I really like you both. Sort this out. Remember you guys used to like each other before. Gemmanda?

[Liv Tyler]

As an ex-judge, I believe that I should probably contribute something to this discussion... by which I mean the photo guidelines. I'm not touching the personal conflicts with a ten-foot pole.

With regards to photoshop... I think it should be allowed. Quite frankly, photoshop is a bugger to use. It takes a long time to alter a photograph or make a magazine cover, and if someone's willing to put in that kind of time and effort, more power to 'em. Photoshopping a picture doesn't give any noticeable advantage when it comes to results - I don't think Charlize retouched a single one of her pictures last season, and she won pretty decisively.

Text and logos in pictures have always been a matter of personal opinion. Some judges care, some don't. It's good to remove them just to make the picture look more professional, but I wouldn't say there's any real need for a "no text" rule.

Screencaps, there's never been a rule against them because there's never needed to be. Screencaps almost always are worse quality than any given modelling shot, and they almost never look professional. If someone wants to waste time screencapping a DVD or video file, I say let 'em. But, on the off chance that someone could find that one frame in a million that looks poised and professional, I'd say screencaps should definitely be allowed.

[Amanda Lee Kimmel]

@ Liv - Photoshop is fine, but you have to remember that the STARTING image has to be of you. You can't take your head and put it on someone else's body. THAT has to be a rule, does it not?

[Rose Byrne]

There have been statements on both boards that have really pissed me right the fuck off.

1. Judges criticizing other judges. Knock that shit off. It's childish and makes me want to vomit all over you. Don't think I won't.

2. There is no reason why text should be on ANY of the photos unless it's a magazine cover OR spread. It's called cropping in paint. Get that shit off there. If you can't, take the time to find another version of the photo that doesn't have the text or select a different one.

3. Do the contestants on the real show get to photo shop their images? NO! Photo shopping was never allowed in the earlier versions of these types of games and shouldn't be allowed now unless specifically stated for a particular challenge saying it's allowed. (Course if you can photo shop and not make it obvious, knock yourself out, it's just a little white lie after all).

4. I'm not answering the survey question at the beginning of the games that asks if I played a past season and who I played anymore and no one else should either. It just keeps it more fair. NOT THAT I WOULD ACCUSE ANYONE OF BIAS! THAT WOULD BE RUDE!

5. STFU!

6. I need a cigarette now and I don't even smoke!

7. Where's my wine?!

[Amanda Lee Kimmel]

Mar 31, 2012 11:53:02 GMT -7 Rose Byrne said:

2. There is no reason why text should be on ANY of the photos unless it's a magazine cover OR spread. It's called cropping in paint. Get that shit off there. If you can't, take the time to find another version of the photo that doesn't have the text or select a different one.

3. Do the contestants on the real show get to photo shop their images? NO! Photo shopping was never allowed in the earlier versions of these types of games and shouldn't be allowed now unless specifically stated for a particular challenge saying it's allowed. (Course if you can photo shop and not make it obvious, knock yourself out, it's just a little white lie after all).

I love how these statements contradict each other. One says "Take out distractions" and the other says "Don't edit your photos!" and the last one says "Lie about it!"

The reason we allow Photoshop is because on the real show, they get make-up, professional photographers, and a lot of things you don't here. Allowing Photoshop allows you to circumvent the limitations of your existing library. This competition is about FINDING photos, not TAKING them, so we at least allow something to help - especially for taking out watermarks and logos. It may be time-consuming, but the more effort you put in, the more deserving a winner you'll make.

[Liv Tyler]

Amanda Lee Kimmel - Well, yes and no. If I were to shop my celebrity's face onto a different photo... that's probably outside the boundaries, but doing that would be incredibly difficult to pull off, and it'd essentially be game suicide. I can't see anybody being crazy enough to risk that.

Mar 31, 2012 11:53:02 GMT -7 Rose Byrne said:

4. I'm not answering the survey question at the beginning of the games that asks if I played a past season and who I played anymore and no one else should either.

I think they only started asking who people were in seasons five and six, and that was only because a lot of times people would reference previous seasons in their confessional, and none of us judges would know what they were talking about. So asking it was actually a way for the contestants to bond with the judges and have a better experience, not a way for the judges to show positive or negative bias.

Besides, these judges have been pretty great about not being biased one way or the other, as far as I'm aware.

[Rose Byrne]

@ Liv. I completely understand your defense of this. So maybe contestants just shouldn't reference past seasons (I know, it's a lot to ask).

It's a new season, with new celebrities, and it should stay that way. Speaking as a judge for these types of games, I know how hard it can be to separate your feelings if you know someone who is playing. I would just rather not have that knowledge because while I know on the surface that I don't find myself favoring someone, subconsciously, everyone is guilty of it.

@ Amanda. First, cropping is not a form of photo shopping. It goes into the same category as re-sizing. Editing THAT way should be fine.

Second, #3 was full of all sorts of sarcasm in the parentheses. I apologize for not making that more clear.

[Liv Tyler]

I agree that it's difficult to separate emotion from the judging, but I think overall the various judges in this series have done well at that. Two of the earlier eliminations in this season were previous winners, after all, and Dianna was a pretty good friend of Janice's (and I think Morgan's as well), so I don't think favoritism has really played much of a role.

ETA: And as for the anti-photoshopping argument... I agree with Amanda. On the real show, if they want to do an Occupation shoot, they give the models a job uniform and a setting; they don't send the models out to go source an occupation photo based on what they can find. This isn't the real show... and if it was, I wouldn't be in the final seven. I'm a 5'10" guy with a beard, who doesn't know the difference between rouge and blush.

The restrictions here are much, much more limited - and besides, out of the ten winners we've had so far, only one (Taylor) did any hardcore photoshopping, so it's not like it's providing any real advantage.

[Janice Dickinson]

I think I went over this in males, but imo photoshop should be used really to touch up, recolour or remove things from the photo. i don't approve of adding major things to a photo - Unless it's for a magazine cover

[Zooey Deschanel]

As far as the whole "Who's Who" thing, even when people answer it, I tend to forget who they are, anyway.

I think I know who two of the players are in this Cycle and one of them went out a couple rounds ago and I just found out who she was a few days ago. The other one's still in, but I know nothing beyond who she was last Cycle and I know really nothing about her personally

[Amanda Lee Kimmel]

I could rattle off who was who, but honestly, I don't really care who people were in a past life. I care about the quality of photos. Always have, always will. Only thing that makes a difference to me is a streak - if a person receives two FCOs in a row, then posts a low-quality photo, I'm more apt to grant them a reprieve.


Also Janice and I have agreed to stop whatever the fuck was going on. I apologize for any inconvenience that may have caused for you gals. Like I said, I've been dealing with a bunch of shit lately.

Lana, I'd like to talk to you about a few things at the soonest possible opportunity.

[Eva Longoria]

I think judges should post their opinions earlier because if you have only 2 critiques it's difficult to make a decission of using your second photo. Then after the deadline you find out that 4 out of 5 judges hate your photo.

[Zooey Deschanel]

I actually just posted earlier today saying why I wait so long to critique pictures. So, I'll just copy and paste what I said there


I normally wait until all pictures have been submitted before I post my critiques. In the Male Cycle, the first time I judged, I found that critiquing as the pictures went up sometimes caused my critiques to not match my rankings. Like there was a shoot that I didn't have high expectations for the models, so the first person to submit his, I only had positive things to say. Then everyone else started submitting and I saw everyone was doing really well with the shoot, so I started to become more critical with them. When my rankings came, the first picture that I had nothing negative to say (because I had low expectations at the time) wound up second-to-last on my rankings, so by just reading my critiques, that wouldn't have matched up.

So, now I'll look at the pictures as they go up and then critique all of them at the end so that I'm critiquing with the same level of expectation for everyone.